INTERVIEW: GHÖSH

GOING DEEP WITH THE NÜ-METAL RAVERS

No doubt, the members of the Insane Clown Posse attended at least a few raves in the 1990s. They were from Detroit, after all. There’s a decent chance they even played one or two. But there is an alternate reality wherein ICP did more than that—they became ravers themselves. 

I can picture it: Maybe they got indoctrinated through hearing the aggro end of Underground Resistance or seeing a performance from The Prodigy. Maybe they took the right drugs in the right room on the right night and the music started to make enough sense for them to want to rip up the playbook and start painting a neon smiley on their faces. Longtime Insane Clown Posse collaborator Mike E. Clark did a one-off techno 12” with Laura Grabb in 1992. There are plenty of connections.

The music of Philly/LA duo Ghösh is a fusion of juggalo and rave tendencies shot through a DIY punk cannon. The band throws all sorts of high-energy music—both “credible” and “cringe”—into a big tent and then dares you not to freak out. Ghösh’s recent single “Devil Lady” is their most realized song to date. It combines nü-metal guitars and speedy jungle breaks and a chorus big and wicked enough to unite all the big-pants parent haters. You know I’m fucking with it.

I really like the new EP. I was listening to it a bunch today. I love “Devil Lady,” for me that’s the most formed version of your band so far. It’s like Korn meets Atari Teenage Riot, and the chorus is super catchy. I’m curious to know more about that song.

Zachary: We’ve been doing these different ideas, but it kind of came together well in “Devil Lady.” I think going full bore into what we wanted to do and it being so well received was also very encouraging. Symphony, you went through a few different iterations of the chorus…

Symphony: It was much more verbose to start, which I feel like is my main problem when I write—I write a lot of words, and I’m trying to say a lot of stuff, and it’s fun to say a lot of stuff quickly, but sometimes you strip it down and it’s much better, and that’s what happened with “Devil Lady.” It’s giving something a little bit of space instead of it being a constant da da da da da. 

So you took some words out of that one?

Symphony: Yeah, I took out a lot of words. It was going to be, like, “If the devil’s real/It doesn’t matter/I’m your boogie witch/Young hot Strega Nona.” And now I’m like, that’s so much to say all in one. Zach came up with the whole back-and-forth thing afterwards.

When you were writing those lyrics, you were pulling from your life, I’m sure, but were you thinking, like, this is something Jonathan Davis might write?

Symphony: A little bit, yeah, a little bit. Sort of Marylin Manson, not being afraid to go all the way spooky, as corny as it can be. 

All this time has passed, The Prodigy and Korn and all this stuff is ultimately coming from a similar kind of place.

Zachary: Definitely, yeah. There’s early Prodigy, one of their first big hits, “Their Law,” they got some metal guitar player to go on that, they played a guitar and re-sampled it, it has that pitchy guitar sample kind of sound. It’s cool, that’s all pretty much a blueprint for an idea of what we want to write. There’s also a Slipknot song on their first record that opens with a break, there’s a drum break that the DJ guy does. They just do it for a second, I’ve always kind of thought, what if they just had a drum break through the whole song, and you had your metal guitars over top? It’s similar tempos—really fast breakcore, and that Slipknot stuff, there’s so much percussion on it anyway, it’s like drum and bass music. 

I think a member of Slipknot was a touring drum and bass DJ who played raves.

Zachary: Makes sense.

Symphony: Yeah that does make sense, I didn’t know that.

This is like the alternate history of the ‘90s and 2000s in music.

Zachary: I have a thing too… The drugs, I feel like nü-metal is also like ecstasy metal in the way that ‘80s is cocaine or the ‘90s grunge, heroin. Nü-metal, it’s groovier and funkier and the clothes are baggier. Maybe it was drugs around at the time.

A lot of those nü-metal people, before it was even called nü-metal, I bet they were going to raves, if only just to get drugs. 

Zachary: Yeah.

With your songwriting, are you thinking about pop music?

Symphony: I think not intentionally, but for sure, I think the songs that come out the catchiest are the songs we probably played around with in a way that felt really natural, and that’s because pop music sinks into your brain. I’ve always got some sort of pop music earworm going on, and if I’m making something up, it happens to sound like that sometimes.

Your songs, they’re aggressive, but there can be a tight structure to them.

Zachary: I love classic rock or even really big pop hits as much as underground music—it has that influence on me because it’s the first stuff I ever heard. I do think that what we do is write songs, and we are kind of playing with the idea of pop song structures, and in the back of my mind it’s always some sort of challenge to unlock that key that would be this irresistible, catchy song. I don’t know if I have it in me to do that, but I suppose in our own way… We’ve referenced jock jams and stuff like that, that’s all stuff that’s played on a big stage, arenas, so definitely it’s in there.

That’s related: Some of this music sounds like it could get played at a sports game.

Symphony: Yeah, and I think it’s because we want it to feel like it’s for your body. It’s beyond just something that you listen to, it’s something that you interact with in a way that is like jock jams, pop music—big stuff that we want you to feel.

Zachary: When I was doing the production early on, I was like, do I want to sound more lo-fi and record these to tape, or do I kind of want to try to make it “radio ready” to the best of my ability? We did some demos to a 4-track cassette, and ultimately we just decided to do something that was a little more modern. And I think that’s been cool, because before I always did more lo-fi things. We haven’t really ever gone to a studio to record—just some drums, basically—everything’s been done at my house, for the most part. It’s fun to try to get those sounds but not spend any money to do that.

Is it a goal to go into a big studio and get a band playing on your records, or no?

Zachary: That would be fun. I think if it was presented… If we got a six figure recording contract, I think it would be, like, woah, that’s cool, but also kind of gross, because I know you don’t have to spend that much money. I always sort of think long term, if we were to survive the grind of being musicians, a touring act or whatever, it always feels like the more you can do stuff for cheap, that will give you more freedom, and you’ll make more money back. I think it would be fun, though, to have a drummer in a band.

Symphony: I think it would be fun, too, and I hear you sort of being, like, Aww, we don’t want to spend the money. But if a genie was, like, Alright, you and a band and fucking Rick Rubin can hang out in a studio and do whatever, that would be sick, for sure.

Zachary: You wouldn’t have to twist my arm too hard to make that. I always thought it would be funny, too, to get a guy like Steve Vai on a record, just this guy that’s known for shredding, and make some ridiculous music. Obviously, an incredible musician, but if you could kind of conduct them to do what you want, it could be a lot of fun. I’ve also joked that I’ve always wanted to record a record in Jamaica with Symphony, that seems like a funny move that you’ve made it.

It’s such a classic mid-career rock star move to go to the Caribbean and make a record that nobody really likes.

Symphony: Yeah.

Zachary: Yeah, but you’re having a good time, hopefully.

What’s that story about Shaun Ryder from Happy Mondays, he went to Barbados and he got hooked on crack or something?

Zachary: Yeah, that’s a pretty incredible story.

Symphony: Never heard that.

Zachary: He blew all their money, he really set back their music career, they were so in debt.

I was thinking about two festivals that you would be appropriate for, and they’re different, but I’m curious which one you would rather play. There’s a festival called Bangface in England, do you know about this festival? 

Zachary: Bangface, no.

Bangface, it’s kind of like the ultimate gonzo rave festival and it happens at some dilapidated holiday park somewhere in England. There’s Bangface, which you might have to do some research on, and then there’s The Gathering of the Juggalos. Both of these festivals would make sense for you. 

Zachary: Symphony’s been to The Gathering, so she can probably actually explain it. I would just say I would go to the British one, because I’ve never crossed the pond, so I would like to do that.

Symphony: The Gathering of the Juggalos, it’s not what it used to be. Ten years ago, I feel like I read about The Gathering and watched documentaries about The Gathering, and they would have these crazy lineups and I would want to go, but now they don’t necessarily. And I’ve been the past two years, and last year they offered for Ghösh to play, but they didn’t want to pay us. And then I found out that they’re really shitty about paying people. I love The Gathering, the crowd is cool—I don’t think they would like us as much as I would want them to, so I think Bangface is better. 

If you were to study the kind of demented British ravers that go to Bangface, in some funny way they might actually be the British equivalent of Jugglaos, now that I think about it.

Zachary: Is it like donk music?

They’ll book Squarepusher next to a donk crew next to some hyperpop. It’s this crazy collection of all these disparate forms of high-energy rave music. 

Symphony: Pete & Bas are playing.

Zachary: Oh, hell yeah.

Symphony: This lineup is sick.

It’s never ultra trendy, it’s picking from these different eras, in that way it kind of reminds me of The Gathering. You’ve talked a bit about your fidelity choices at the beginning of the group, but how have your influences developed since you started?

Zachary: When I first started doing Ghösh, I was dipping my toes into electronic music production. I used Ableton for almost 10 years, but sort of dabbled in it here and there, I played mostly in rock groups. I wanted to do something else, but I had a hard time figuring out how to present it until I met Symphony and that gave me confidence to be, like, OK… Because I presented it to her and she liked it. 

Symphony: Ghösh is my first project, performing, and I think I went in feeling like there was something that I had to… I had to have particular influences, where I could say this is like this and this is like this, and you could point out these references. And, the more that we delved into our other influences that are really broad—because Zach and I have really eclectic, bizarre music tastes—it’s been well received. So, having people like what we do when we just sort of do what we like, it makes us more comfortable. So, I feel like our influences are more broad, because they are more of a reflection of our friendship, our merged music tastes, the stuff that we bounce back and forth and are just into—which is a lot.

Zachary: The way that I discover music now—like probably for everybody, Spotify—has kind of fucked up… I used to go on AllMusic back in the day, or go to a record store and find stuff… I try to do other things, I try to listen to a lot more radio, stuff on YouTube, to try to get out of the algorithm. My music discovery, the trajectory seems sort of different. What influences me is often some song I just heard, and that inspires me to maybe try to reverse engineer it or take something from that.

I feel like we are in a real glory period for boutique internet radio stations.

Zachary: I started paying for NTS because I was listening to it so much, I’ve been really digging that.

It’s endless. If I were a kid right now, I would be so psyched. I was so into college radio, but the options right now, if you want to listen to music and not be actively scrubbing Spotify, are pretty nice. I’m trying to be positive about music, you know? That’s what this blog is about. These radio stations can be pretty inspiring.

Zachary: They are. It’s super cheap, too. I also think Spotify has kind of devalued music. NTS, you can get it for five bucks a month. Yeah, you can’t change tracks, but it’s so great. They have something on almost any type of music and you can learn a lot. It brings a bit of that humanity back to it, that discovery that I really missed.

So, what’s next? You gonna hit the road?

Symphony: We’re playing some shows in California in July and into August. We’re playing some shows back East at the end of August in September.

Zachary: Yeah, we’re going up to Canada.

Oh, hell yeah. Have either of you been up there before? 

 Symphony: We played in Montreal, Zach is from Canada. 

Zachary: We played in February, it was really fun, it’s the same promoter, he booked us at this festival in Northern Quebec, so it’s seven hours north of Montreal. We’re going to play three dates in Canada, we’re going to do Montreal, Northern Quebec, and Toronto. They’re back to back to back, which is going to be hell driving, but I think they’re all going to be really fun shows. I’m pretty confident.

What can readers to this newsletter expect from the Ghösh live experience? 

Symphony: A fun night, for sure.

Zachary: Again, we’re going to lay it on the line, it’s fast, the songs are sort of in a punk style, we run them together really quickly, there’s makeup.

Symphony: There’s makeup, there’s lights.

Zachary: There’s guitars, there’s drum breaks, there’s fast tempos…

Symphony: Sometimes there’s other stuff, like silly string or pool noodles.

Zachary: Blow-up devices.

Symphony: We bring props.

Zachary: It’s like anything, if the audience gives us more, we feed off of that.

Symphony: I get a little feisty if people don’t interact. Just because I’m sensitive and I like to see people enjoying themselves. 

PRISMASSIVE is out now on Ramp Local. Ghösh on Instagram and Twitter.