INTERVIEW: LIZ STIPPELL
THE TIKTOK USER REVIEWING ROLLING STONE’S TOP 500 ALBUMS
I have a strange relationship with TikTok. Almost five years ago, I did a music video with the director Eugene Kotlyarenko that was made entirely using the app. It was the first of its kind, I think, and though it got a modest amount of attention, it predated TikTok’s real boom by maybe a year. When I made that video, I thought of TikTok as an app primarily used for dancing and lip-syncing. In reality, TikTok is a mutant hybrid of short-form video and cable-access television, all wrapped up in the most addictive algorithm in the biz. Like many, I am tortured about the time I spend looking at TikTok. It is probably not good for me, but is it any worse than binging six hours of middling prestige television while scrolling Instagram? Sound off in the comments...
Congress is currently attempting to force ByteDance, the app’s Chinese owner, to either sell TikTok or get banned in the USA. A few days ago, I opened up the app, and I was greeted with white text on a black background urging me to call my representatives. It should go without saying that the politics behind this attempted ban are outside of the limited scope of both John’s Music Blog and John’s Tiny Brain, so here I am going to finally get to the point of today’s post: Liz Stippell (username: Lizstip) is a 24-year-old TikTok user who has been reviewing Rolling Stone’s list of "The 500 Greatest Albums of All Time" for the past year or so. I wanted to ask her some questions, for my music blog.
I’ve enjoyed the Long Island-raised, Los Angeles-based Stippell’s posts, as entertainment—she has a nice deadpan demeanor; recently, as a result of Universal Music Group pulling their catalog from TikTok, she has been singing songs acapella; she listens with her dog Rocky—and as a window into a younger generation’s ideas about music. It’s interesting to watch a zoomer engage with one of the hallmarks of the boomer rock and roll establishment, and do so in good faith and with good humor. Stippell is neither reverent nor snarky; it’s been fun rocking with her as she climbs down the list. And there’s whole lot more music to go.
I don't know if you've ever done an interview about this project?
Not really, no. So this is a new experience.
I've been enjoying following it over the past, how long has it been?
It's been a little bit over a year by this point. I've been taking my time with it.
It’s quite the undertaking. What prompted you to do it?
In all honesty, I kind of realized that I was listening to the same music every day, which is great. It's music that I enjoyed, but I was like, I don't think I'm really experiencing all that there is to offer. And I found out that this list existed of the 500 greatest albums of all time. And I was like, this is perfect.
How many of these records do you think you've heard before?
I would say maybe like 20 percent I've heard before. A lot of the artists so far I know of, but I've never really dove into their discographies.
Have any artists been good enough that you've listened to more records from them?
Not necessarily more records, but there have been songs from the artists where I'm like, Oh my gosh, I absolutely love this song. And so I'll end up revisiting those songs a lot, just in my daily listening.
So you have a playlist of the top picks from each record?
Yeah.
People often talk about how the record is dead or whatever—you know, listeners just want to pick out their favorite song and put it on a playlist. For you, what was your listening like before this process started? Were you listening to many full records?
If an artist comes out with a record, I'm going to listen to it all the way through. And it really comes down to whether or not I think the artist was really intentional with the order of the songs. If it tells a story through the song order, then there are must-have albums that I feel you need to listen to all the way through in order to get the full experience. I just listened to My Chemical Romance’s The Black Parade, and that's one of those albums where it's something that I feel like you need to listen to all the way through.
I feel like music has definitely changed, from listening to albums from the ‘70s to more recent albums on the list. You can tell that there's a really big shift. For example, a lot of the albums now are a lot shorter than they were back in the day. So I think that's pretty interesting. I get some albums from the ‘60s, ‘70s, ‘80s that are an hour to two hours long. And then you listen to stuff today and it's like a half an hour long album. So it's super interesting.
It’s really genre specific. There's certain kinds of rap records that just pad their tracklisting for streaming, but then you're right, new indie rock records can be really short.
Yeah.
I like that you have a positive attitude about a majority of these records. You seemingly like more stuff than you dislike. Would you say that's true, that within most of these records you find something to like?
The whole idea is to experience new music and to broaden my horizons. So I go into listening to these albums with a more positive mindset. Because that's what I want to get out of it. I'm not looking to say that these albums are horrible. I'm not looking to, you know, really nitpick things. I'm saying, Let's expand my horizons and let's see what I can get out of this in a more positive way. And this has been really a positive experience for me, to get out of my comfort zone and listen to all these different genres and different artists.
Are there any genres or artists that have surprised you? Stuff that you really didn't investigate so much before the project but you love now?
Yeah. And this is kind of going back to what I was saying earlier about how some albums, I feel like you have to listen to all the way through. A lot of the hip hop albums are like that, because they have all of these skits and interludes. It's this combination of what we describe as music, whether it be rapping or songs, and then they throw in these skits and things. And so it really surprised me how much I love hip hop. It was kind of a genre that I never really listened to before. So that was a cool experience.
I assume the Rolling Stone list, it's probably a lot of ‘90s and 2000s records, and a lot of those albums are pretty cinematic in how they're sequenced.
Yeah. And I was born in ‘99. So it's not music that I ever really grew up listening to, because it was kind of before my time. So it's cool to kind of revisit what was going on before I was born, really, and when my sisters’ were young.
Does any of this music sound dated to you in any certain way? It could be argued that musical innovation has stalled a bit—like, you maybe grew up listening to new bands that actually sounded like they were from the ‘60s or ‘70s.
It's super interesting. And I've spoken about this a couple of times in my reviews, but there's this sort of ‘70s music that I just don't like because I think it does feel dated, whether that's in the sound quality or just the makeup of the song. So really, if I feel like if an album has withstood the test of time, I'm gonna probably rate it higher and enjoy it more.
One of the few records that I could think of that you just didn't like, which I thought was interesting and funny, was the Nuggets compilation.
I have a bone to pick with any sort of compilation. It’s something that I don't feel is appropriate for this type of list. So automatically, if it's a greatest hits sort of album, any sort of anthology album, I do not appreciate it, because I feel like there are so many deserving artists that could easily take that spot.
I was like going back and watching your videos, and there were only a couple of other records you didn't like—there was a Kinks record and a Grateful Dead record.
I will say, on that Grateful Dead album, I got some pushback from the Deadheads, which was the nicest pushback that I've ever experienced during this project.
That’s good.
So shout to all the Deadheads out there. Really, what I didn't like about that album was it wasn't what I had expected. I've heard of the Grateful Dead, but I guess I've never really listened to them, because a lot of my older music taste is from what my parents listened to, and they weren't really into the Grateful Dead. But it just wasn't what I expected. And to me, that was more of a negative. Sometimes, if it's not what I expected, it's definitely a positive.
If you showed someone the Grateful Dead's logo, they might think they sounded a little bit tougher than they actually sound.
Yeah. So it was super interesting.
So, you’ve gotten some pushback from other fans that has been less pleasant than your pushback from Grateful Dead fans?
Yeah, because the thing is, right, it's the algorithm. The algorithm is going to push the videos to certain groups. So if it sees that my video is about, again, let's say the Grateful Dead, it's going to push it to people who like the Grateful Dead. And so if I dislike the album, it's still getting pushed to the fans who enjoy it. And their opinions are 100 percent valid. I'm not trying to say my opinion is the only opinion. It’s never about that. And I think that's really what some fans are missing. Like, I try to keep it a subjective review. And that's why I do my most favorite song and my least favorite song, rather than best song and worst song, to kind of reiterate to people that I am not trying to say that my opinion is the only opinion that matters.
I like the sort of preamble part of the video. Before you go into the actual review, I'm never quite sure what you're going to think about the record—the music might be playing, but you're pretty stoic there in front of the camera.
That's because I don't know how to record with the music playing. So I have to add the music when I start editing it. And so whenever I'm recording, like whatever I'm doing in that listening section, it's just complete silence. There's nothing to react to.
But I think it plays into the overall vibe. You're very positive, but there's also this deadpan thing that kind of works against that positivity in a cool way. The other thing I've noticed is that recently you've just been doing DIY acapella versions of songs from the records. I assume that's because of UMG pulling their catalog from TikTok?
A day or two before, I actually saw a video that was like, UMG is taking all of its music down. And so I was like, How am I going to be able to adapt to this? And the biggest thing is that I just wanted it to be fun, you know? So I was like, What can I do where I will not be taken seriously at all? I should just sing all of the songs. And hopefully my singing is bad enough that it doesn't get flagged. So that's also just been a really fun time. It's a new challenge to try to record myself singing a song that I've only listened to maybe two or three times, because I only listen to the albums two or three times before I formulate my opinion on it.
The acapellas are great. You should put out a cassette tape.
We'll see. We'll see. Because I'm doing these songs acapella, they get stuck in my head so much easier now. It takes me a couple takes to make it like, okay enough to post, you know? So yeah, I get a lot of these songs stuck in my head.
Are you committed to doing this full project? You're pushing around 200 reviews now?
I'm just around 360, so that means I've done about 140. I am. I am committed. I just need to get my game face on and remind myself to listen every day, because that's the hardest part, because I really want to be present when I'm listening to these albums. So that takes a little bit more brainpower than just kind of putting music on in the background while I work.
Do you even have much time to listen to new music now?
Not really. Sometimes I'll do cleanses. I'll do a day or two of listening to the music that I usually listen to and I know really well. And then I'll go back to listening to a brand new album.
It’s cool, because right now you’re up in the 300, 400 range—you're dealing with classic records, but you haven't gotten to any of the ultra heavy shit yet.
That's the thing. There's a couple of artists that I've been waiting for. So, of course, I'm hoping that they're very low on the list, like top 100, but yeah, it's kind of exciting. Obviously, The Beatles is a big one. I haven't heard any Michael Jackson yet. Beyonce—these really, really big artists that haven't shown up yet. And it's almost like I feel them waiting.
You have to get through Yo La Tengo and Luther Vandross first.
Yeah. Which I keep reminding myself.
You compare every release you review to the song “Give It Up” by the cast of the Nickelodeon sitcom Victorious. What about that song works so well as an objective barometer for every record to be compared to?
Originally, when I thought about putting this on TikTok, I was like, what can I do to kind of signal to people that this is just for fun, that it's not supposed to be rigorous, that it's not supposed to be negative. And I was listening to a lot of Nickelodeon music, because it takes me back to when I was younger. And I was like, I love this song. It's two amazing vocalists in Liz Gillies and Ariana Grande. Vocally, they're both very talented. And ultimately, it's just a song that makes me feel really energized and really pumped up. It's just kind of fun to have the 500 best albums of all time and compare them to a song from a Nickelodeon TV show, you know?
I don't know if you tabulate it, but it seems like less records have been better than that song. Is that true?
I would think so. Yeah. I am sort of working on a spreadsheet, because I really want to see if, as I go down the list, the records are actually getting higher ratings. But it's tough to beat that feeling, you know? So yeah, Luther Vandross, I'm sorry, but I don't think that record was better than “Give It Up” by the Victorious cast.